* spads ong va sf the #L: 1me food to this cocom be the F mei verment; and of the dumped té cur "En mratios agad t them, vuch, IA, E A satireno gromod for wan setuer DO KT properla remoncrate aga as I e me ten by the paper on the table: but that the rm7.1 and if that peoed verst vier materinat de vară remonstrasens is an adequte qué i one might be found a the there at which I war, I cannot teng melf to a gre made it the time in was proem id to renew the regard may laces a fort, and ɗa_17 secting sa the Cash Payment of the Back z that the mate of Europe was the best arṛte: that could be armed in favour of its addorite. Misirers are also artsied of not mikiny for TLAOvercoms to Mariament of the exams that gave rise to the dimens Sert comm tions might be attended with the worst effect), 12 d Therefore it was prudent to withheld them eat. the time came box mak aytem with safety. to the aghastica from ever and, it is true that it took gare Melure the meeting of Par.samt, hat it was then earnestly wished that no resist ance should be made on their part. Ning was there then any combination that could give any effect to a remonstrance in their behalf. When that combination afterwards took pare, it was too late to make any vorrental remonstrance, -With regard to Hollan 1, the R. Hon. Gent, compaised that strong and vigorous remonstrances had not been made for the removal of the French troops from that country. The contrary would asosar from the instructions given to Ld. Wht-'I Hopes were given by Mr. Listen on the en November, that the French troops would evacuate Holland; but on the 12th, that expectation wa, discouraged. The French Government expressed a a with that the troops destined for Louikana might continue some time longer in the Ba-, tavian térratorics: with which wish the Eatavian Government seemed disposed to comply; for they hinted a desire that we should forslea to interpoie in their behalf. On the subject of the Cape of Good Hope, much had been said, and more value has been attached to that poversion than, perhaps, it deserves. In my opinion it is of much jess value then other possessions which his Ma- | jesty's ministers were anxious to retain. Besides, the retaining of it would involve a large expense; for during the time we were in possession of it, that expense amounted to no less than two mil-, Fors Whatever its value might he estimated at by others, I could never bring myself to imagine that we shou'd forego, for its sake, the chance of retaining more valuable po sessions. The Rt. Hon. Gent, in speaking of Malia, seemed to suppose that an engagement respecting it had been, entered into with Russia; no such engagement had taken place, nor any thing approaching to it. Previous to the conclusion of the Preliminaries, a communication had been made to the Russian Government of the heads of the arrangement respecting Malta, and then no objection was made

a nt and remonstrauce, but not cé vz. variety of examples gut badanT wirs regard to the Conterra Comm and the intention with waca i na n they were sent into the British domaines, e 5We frend remonstrated in the most spirited m and he received a daroval of the parpout for which they were supposed to be inteased : he did not stop here; as soon as a opes 1-4 vanished of concluding a commercial treary, Government refused to recognise them, and were instructed to remove from the counter. The only one of them who attempted to remain en away from Jersey, by virtue of an crea the secretary of State's Cice, and an rom was sent to Gen. Andreossi, that uses th withdrew force would be employed to emsel them. Wel it now be contended that no m strances have been made against the insult, and in aries offered to the country by the French G vernmen', or that they have been ali disregardez " veerare to hope, this if more energetic measura have not been pursued, the House will mast cz alowance for the difficulties in which males were placed-Ministers anxiously wished to preserve peace, but notwithstanding that anxiety, the honour of the country was never comm med The documents on the table will exhibes marks of forbearance, but not one of unbecom.g weakness. While there remained a hope of peat no communication was made to Parliament, x cause it was thonght that such communications would frustrate rather than promote the attaine ment of the desirable object. What the condit of ministers has been throughout, I hope that te House have now before them full and ample em musications, and if a single document be wanting, by the help of which the conduct of ministers may be retter elucidated, it shall be furnished without delay. In my own and their name I n now ready to say, that in whatever light they may be induced to behold their conduct, ministers are ready to meet their decision. We only call for a decision; we do not venture to ask for approba tion: we are anxious, however, to escape censure. If it be merited, we submissively acquiesce in the sentence of the House; but if it be unmerited let our minds be relieved from the charges which the resolutions hang over us, and let them go un'ettered to the discharge of those arduous duties of which they are desirous to acquit themselves with zeal, diligence, and fidelity. Let us know that

we do not go forth in the eyes of the country the work of a day. With all the functions of exebranded with the stigma of the displeasure of thecutive power suspended, with the regular means House; or if we have unfortunately incurred their of communication between Parliament and the disapprobation, let it be proved by a direct Throne interrupted, weeks, nay month, wafted in charge; if the House say the charge is not found- doubt, uncertainty, and inaction, how could the ed, our gratitude will be unbounded: if they say public safely consent, with a ftate of things so it is, we shall bow to the decision with the con- violent and unnatural as would result from Parlia sciousness of having exerted our best endeavours ment rendering one administration incapable of to deserve a better fate. exercising any public functions without any other efficient government being obtained in its ftead? MR. PITT-If I possessed a full and clear opi- I will venture to hint also that after such a step nion on the merits of the case, to the extent of any adminiftration that should succeed, he what either directly negativing or adopting the resolu- it might and what it would be, muft ftill depend tions which have been proposed, I should, follow-upon the Crown, would feel itself placed in a most ing the unbiassed dictates of my conscience, give delicate situation. To put the matter as conscimy vote on that side to which my judgment in-entiously and delicately as possible, would any clined. If I agreed with my. Rt. Hon. Friend, Mr. set of men feel their introduction to power in Grenville, in thinking that the firs: steps we ought these circumftances to be such as to enable them to take in duty to the public, were by a retrospec to discharge, in a manner satisfactory to themtive survey of the conduct of ministers to judge of selves, the duties which so eventful a period must their fitness to exercise the functions to which impose? These are considerations for the Crown they are called, and if upon that result I were and the Public; and they outweigh all those forced to conclude, that the papers on the table which present themselves, on a partial view of afforded evidence of criminality, of incapacity, of the advantages which could be hoped from a promisconduct; then, however painful the sacrifice secution of that censure and dissolution of admiof private feelings might be in taking such a part niftration to which the propositions tend. I am in the case of individuals whom I respect, I should aware that the Rt. Hon. Gent. on the floor, and feel myself bound to concur in an address to his my friends on the same bench with him, must feel Majesty, for the removal of his ministers. On the their situation irksome under the weight of a ques other hand, if I were one of those who considered tion so important, in which they are personally the explanation afforded by ministers upon gene-involved, remaining undecided. Nevertheless, ral points, so clear as to justify a decided negative when other sacrifices are demanded for the public of the propositions moved by the Hon. Gent. over interest, personal feelings must be overlooked. the way—a negative which would imply approba- Those who, with me, have not made up their tion, for in such a matter to avoid ground of cen- minds to the extent of censuring minifters by the sure, may be considered the same as to have de- adoption of the propositions, or approving their served applause; I should feel myself happy in conduct by agreeing to a direct negative, must joining in a decisive negative to the motion. But pursue some middle course. Those who, on the to this extent, either of approbation or of cen- examination of the papers, from any feeling of sure, I am unable to go. I cannot concur in the regret for the steps which minifters took in the nelatter, or in the extent of the charges involved in gotiation, must consult their conscience on the the propositions which have been moved. Be- vote they are to give. They cannot do that which sides, I am aware of the inconveniencies that must imply approbation when they do not find would result from supporting any measure which from the case made out that approbation has been has the tendency of the present motion, unless deserved; neither can they vote severe censure the clearest necessity exists for it. Though I do leading to an address for removal, when they do not dispute the right of this House to address the not consider the charges mad completely sustainKing for the removal of ministers, yet nothing is ed. Having ftated the opposite lines of conduc more mischievous than a Parliamentary interfer- which present themselves in deciding upon the ence by declared censure, rendering the continu- propositions, I do not intend to enter into any deance of ministers in office impossible, unless that tailed discussion of the papers. I wish if good interference is justified by extraordinary exigency cannot be obtained by continuing to discuss them, of affairs. Not disputing the right of the House, comparable to the evil of interrupting the course I contend that the right is to be governed by a of our parliamentary duty, to suspend them altosound discretion and by the public interest. We gether. Since things more urgent and more immust look to considerations of public expediency portant demand our care, let us make good the and of public safety. There are some questions parliamentary pledge we have given. I shall bein the discussion of which Gent. must feel more hold with much greater satisfaction, as firft proofs than they can well express, and this, with re- of our determination to support his Majefty with gard to the interference of Parliament for re- our lives and fortunes, you, presenting a strong moving ministers, is one of them. Admitting Bill of Supply, providing resources, not merely for even that there were considerable grounds of every demand of public service, but adequate to dissatisfaction at the conduct of ministers, would every cle of exertion; a measure that will disit tend to promote those exertions, to encou- play and call forth the means of sustaining the rage those sacrifices, which the difficulty and ftruggle, not merely for one year, but, till we shall danger of our situation require? Would our have brought it to a successful issue; some meameans of suftaining the struggle in which we are sure by which we shall be enabled to complete our engaged, and of calling forth those resources ne- army, and to call into action the national ftrength, cessary for our defence, be improved by cutting and give activity to all the military skill, disshort the date of adminiftration, and unsettling cipline, and experience we possess. I do not know the whole system of government? To displace one if gentlemen feel as I do upon this occasion, or if administration and to introduce a new one is not I have been successful in making my feelings unVOL, III. * 3 D

derstood. Impressed as I am with those feelings, and unprepared for the decisive vote which is of ferred in the direct negative, or affirmative of the propositions before the House, I move that the other orders of the day be now read.

ftances when the government in one point ba given up, yet the charges were met boldly, and d rectly negatived. He wished that, on the pres occasion, minifters might either be acquitted condemned. He was sure, from what he knew i his right hon. friend, that his motives in bring LORD HAWKESBURY. He said, that never before forward a previous question were pure and had he risen in Parliament with such feelings as | right, but ministers could not acquiesce in the t those that now oppressed him. With every wish credit of a suspended censure. If it were the to do juftice to the feelings of his right hon. friend, sire of minifters to retain their places at aki he in making the motion with which he had con-zards, they might accept the compromise whe cluded his speech, he and his colleague should be had been offered, but he could say for himself a shrinking from their duty to themselves, if they his colleagues, that they had no desire to reme could accept the compromise offered, between in office longer than they could be useful to the a direct censure and a total acquittal. A charge country. If he felt himself reduced to that sitte of crimination founded upon papers laid on the tion in which he could not serve it with ad table, had been brought forward. He asked, if tage, he would carry the seals to the feet of there was an inftance in which propositions found- gracious Sovereign, and intreat him to appoint ed on such documents and involving the conduct successor more worthy. It was that they of minifters had not been met either with a direct not remain in office discredited, and useless, negative or affirmative? A motion of inquiry he muft oppose the previous queftion; * might be got rid of by a previous queftion; but could not think of remaining an hour in cxel when a direct charge was made, grounded on facts, ter having forfeited the confidence of the bas rising out of public documents, a previous ques. and the good opinion of the country. tion was not the fit way of disposing of the subject. No man was more ready than he was to acknowledge the prerogative of the Crown to choose its minifters; but on the other hand, minifters were responsible to Parliament for the exercise of their functions, and when Parliament saw suficient grounds of censure they ought to state it, and then minifters, no longer able usefully to serve the public, ought to retire. Independent of private considerations, he must contend that the credit of the government ought to be maintained, particularly at such a crisis as the present. But he had no difficulty in saying, that those who wished to deftroy the administration, ought to vote for the resolutions, because that was their obvious tendency, while the vote which his right hon. friend had proposed, would have the effect to discredit government, to leave them discredited, in possession of functions which they could not exercise with honour to themselves nor advantage to the public. His right hon. friend (Mr. Pitt) had declined going into details. He wished, however, that he had afforded some details, that he had pointed out those parts of the conduct of ministers which he could not approve, that they might have an opportunity of meeting any charge, or explaining what was deemed exceptionable. It was possible that in a long, and arduous course of conduct, some points might be liable to objection. In a country like this, however, he always considered it to be the fair principle, both of support and of opposition to minifters, that those who agreed or disagreed with them should do so on a general syftem. It was not to be expected that all should approve every particular point. They were to overlook minor differences for the sake of giving effect to the general scheme of measures and conduct which they approved. These he had always understood, where the general principles, and he regretted that Mr. Pitt had not made up his mind to act upon them. He asked whether, after surveying the conduct of minillers during a period of unexampled difficulty, he was not now prepared to say yes, or no, directly to a motion of censure:-On the Russian armament, he well remembered that his right hon. friend and himself had not thought it sufficient to get rid of a motion of censure by a previous queftion, but in circum

MR. CANNING declared, that he rose in d charge of a solemn duty with feelings scarcely ferior to those so creditably manifefted by ha ble friend. For the first time in his life he was y an over-ruling sense of duty to vote diferent from his right hon. friend. He was so far agreed with his noble friend as to give a vote that t to decide the case at once; he felt himself bound to give him that explicit answer. After the atple manner in which the question had been dis cussed, he merely rose to express the ground of his vote, fearful that a silent vote might be liable it misconftruction. He had often expressed his nion of his Majesty's government which the pers now before the House moft fully confirmed, and as to the first point, shewed clearly that t negotiation was very far from being managed in ftatesman-like way. As to the second resol that his Majefty's minifters had with-held in tion to Parliament, and even practised a delusi upon it, relative to the discussions with Fran this, he conceived, ftrictly proved, as Parliament had been taught to expect security, when gre ment knew the peace, of which they boaffed, was crumbling into pieces. He wished the House consider the great injury this species of impos tion was to every class of society; it had, by the excess of disappointment, rendered them adequate to act up to the exigency of their present arduous situation. Hence he was prepare to say, in the language of the resolution, that the conduct of government was such as he explic condemned. He thought, that they had negler. many opportunities of resifting, with firmness an effect, the insults and aggressions of France. differed from the right hon. gent. on the for (Mr. Addington), and would not think that ar extraordinary allowance was to be made to a lar less Usurper. A spirited and timely oppositi to his unjust views might, on the contrary, ha taught him a different lesson. In another point he differed from that Gent. namely, that the evid of war could never come too late. He, on the contrary, thought that permission in many case operated as an invitation to proceed, and that if the insult and aggressions of Buonaparté had iset properly resisted in the first instanse, we now

should have been spared the emergency of war. As to the 4th resolution he thought it justified by the dates of the papers; but it appeared by them that after the Cape was retained, no explanation was demanded on the score on which it was retained. By this, and other surrenders thus made, while dis pute was pending, and war obvious, it became of course more difficult to make a stand on that point which ministers themselves admitted was essential. If Malta was the cause of war, all that was done should have been done as bearing on that question; whereas ministers had now given up every thing before the question was brought on. Upon these grounds he proposed to vote directly for the resolutions in censure of ministers. As to the insinuation thrown out by an honourable baronet, that all opposition was only an effort to obtain places, he begged to assure him that it was wholly disregarded by him, and that he never knew it made but by those who were most open to its application. There had been all along a most unusual forbearance on the part of the country and the House towards ministers. Not one motion had been brought forward in opposition to government befor the present. They had been allowed a most unexampled degree of latitude. If they had been harassed with perpetual motions they would have had some right to complain, but never was any administration treated with so much allowance. How far they were now deserving of it, the House and country were to say. From the 23d of November to the 8th of March not a motion had been made. Since the 8th of March, still yet more deference had been shewed.-Nothing had been said till government themselves brought forward some subject connected with public affairs, and until they had agreed to separate their own conduct from their country's cause.

HOUSE OF LORDS.

Mondy, June 6. (Min. 872.)

[CONDUCT OF MINISTERS.]-EARL FITZWILLIAM, pursuant to the notice he had given, rose, and after a short introductory speech, expressive of his strong disapprobation of the conduct of ministers, since the negotiation of the late treaties of peace, brought forward certain resolutions, founded on the positions advanced in the course of his speech, and implying a censure upon his Majesty's ministers.

THE DUKE OF CLARENCE observed, that notwithstanding his personal respect for the noble earl, whose parliamentary conduct ever was manly, and consistent, yet holding the opinions he did, he could not support the resolution just moved. With respect to for ministers, he thought they deserved thanks, even having so long procured the blessings of peace as they had done. He was well aware of the difficulties of any negotiation with France; that such could be brought to a pacific issue, was matter of surprise to him, and under these impressions he regarded it as a matter of experiment. With respect to the preliminaries, when he considered the circumstances in which the country was placed at that time, they ought to have been satisfactory: but into the subject of the definitive treaty, he should not then enter. He could not avoid adverting to the gross misconduct of the late ministers, which had brought the country into that situation in which the present ministers found it; and he avowed his readiness to meet any noble lord with respect to any military event which had taken place since the marching of the Guards in February, 1793, to the period of the present ministers coming into power. With respect to the affair of Malta, he expressed his opinion, that under the circumstances of the case, ministers were justified in maintaining it; what reductions of force had taken place were a proof of the hope ministers entertained of being able to execute the treaty. He alluded to the language of one of his Majesty's late speeches, considering it as dictated by ministers, which he commended as wise, moderate, and firm; and also the prudence of ministers in having the naval force of the country, at the time of delivering the message, nearly in as good a state as in a period of war. He adverted to the conduct of ministers with respect to the affair of Swisserland, and the temporary retention SIR R. PEELE disapproved of the conduct of mi- of the Cape, which H. R. H. approved; and he nisters since the definitive treaty. He said, that to- alluded to the insolent menaces of the enemy, that wards the latter end of the last glorious war, mini-England could not meet France single-handed: the sters had received the national firm of army and navy, in the best condition, but since that time a great part of the army had been disbanded, and the strength of the navy had been allowed to fall away. He did not think that ministers were adequate to the present crisis.

THE MASTER OF THE ROLLS defended the conduct of ministers, and opposed the previous question, because the fair way was to come to a decisive vote. He said it was unfair to try the conduct of ministers on the principles of those who opposed the treaty of Amiens. The part of ministers in concluding the peace was arraigned, and on the same grounds their endeavours to preserve it. Ministers should be tried on the principle recognised and approved by almost the whole nation, that it was fit and proper to endeavour to put an end to the last war,

THE SECRETARY AT WAR called for a decisive vote on the same grounds with his colleagues. He said that the militia, and a certain portion of the army, had been disbanded on peace, but the military force of this country was never in a better state than it was at present. He defended the conduct of the Admiralty. He shewed that we had a naval force in every quarter superior to the enemy; and in Europe superior to that of the French by a much greater proportion than had ever happened on the breaking out of any war,

experience of ages and the page of history refuted this untruth, and evinced that England never encountered France with so much energy, effect, or advantage, as when she was single handed, " And," added his royal highness," he who makes such an assertion "is either a liar in his heart, or a fool, that should "be sent to school to learn better." He gave ministers full credit for their endeavours to maintain peace, as long as it could consistently be done; and concluded by warmly declaring his conviction, that the country suffered much from the gross misconduct of his Majesty's late ministers; and that sooner than they should again be brought into his Majesty's councils, he would do any thing to keep the present ministers in power.

LORD COVENTRY said, that ministers had a third enemy to contend with, and that was a party, which * 3 D 2

was excellently described in those lines of Pope ap- vigour and energy, to an honourable and successful plied to Addison, beginning,

"Willing to wound, and yet afraid to strike."

EARL MINTO Supported the resolutions.-As an accurate report of his Lordship's eloquent speech has been published, it is thought unnecessary to attempt any abridgement of it here.

EARL GROSVENOR thought the resolutions could not be for a moment entertained by the House, after the decided vote in favour of ministers given on a former evening. He was anxious that the noble lord who brought them forward should consent to their being withdrawn. He vindicated the whole of the conduct of ministers, which he thought deserving of the confidence of parliament and the country.

LORD BOLTON said, that though in some parts of the conduct of ministers he had doubts of its propriety, yet on the whole he felt himself inclined to give it his general approbation. He rejoiced that the French government had not accepted of the propositions of ministers relative to Malta. Fortunately it was now in our possession, and he trusted it never would be relinquished.

LORD WARWICK, though he greatly approved of the spirit of the resolution, wished the noble earl to withdraw his motion, as under the present circumstances he thought the discussion could not be productive of advantage to the country.

THE EARL OF SCARBOROUGH defended the conduct of the late administration, which he thought had saved every thing valuable in this world from destruction. As for the measures of the present ministers they had been such as he could by no means approve.

termination.

LORD HOBART assured the House that the army had been no where reduced where it could possiby be avoided. Every body was aware that the milita must necessarily be reduced on the cor clasion of articles of peace; the period of the teneil les' service also terminated with the war. The service of many of the army was also at an end with the war; but as many as could be retained, by giving them a ia bounty, were retained. As to the orders and counti orders which some noble lords had noticed in such terms of severity, the House would please to observe that it was not a partial or incomplete measure con fined to only one or two places; the same sort of or ders and counter-orders were sent out to every island in the West Indies, as well as to the Cape. If Aus tria or the other great continental powers did not think fit to interfere, to check the ambition of the First Consul after the signing of the treaty of Amiers, he did not think that we should single handed con tend about the Cape; and the answers received from other courts might be deemed a sufficient reason for ministers altering their conduct. The Cape had last war cost 2 millions, which was more than its value could be fairly estimated at for that period. He had also the best naval authority for stating, that it was not absolutely necessary to stop at the Cape in gong to the East Indies, and coming back, it was en necessary, in case of tempestuous weather. I: bad been stated, on the authority of rumour, in another place, that he had refused to have any conference with the Maltese deputies in his office. This he po sitively denied, and assured the House that he had two meetings with those Gentlemen upon the affais of their unhappy country.

LORD GRENVILLE stated, that the present charge was entirely the reverse of that adopted by other LORD DE DUNSTANVILLE called the attention of noble lords. They were of opinion that ministers their lordships to the treaty of Amiens, (which he were culpable for not going to war sooner, he charg now considered as dead and buried), to the unfa-ed them with criminality in not avoiding the war vourable circumstances under which it was made. If peace had not then been made, the tables of both Houses of parliament would have been covered with petitions, which would lead to the conclusion of peace under still more unfavourable circumstances. He vindicated the conduct of ministers during the late negotiation, for which, instead of censure, he deemed them intitled to the thanks of the House.

altogether. He then went over the different grounds of a difference of sentiment which had been urged on each side of the question. If it could be cleaily proved, however, that ministers had not been guilty of neglecting to accept the mediation of Russia, or any other power pacifically inclined, he should think them entitled to a verdict of acquittal. But, if on the other hand, it was proved to the satisfaction of the House that such mediation had ben offered, and that they had neglected to accept the offer, they were subject to a most awful responsibility. An unoffcial paper, most certainly, but to which he had every reason to give credit, had asserted that such an ofier had been made, but that, "one of the contracting parties had with-held their assent." He could not suppose-it was not by any means probable, that France was this contracting power; England therefore must be the power which refused. A noble ld. opposite had referred to the peace of 1763, and contrassted it with the navy we had now at our com mand. That could not, on mature deliberation, be considered a fair mode of comparison; we should take into the account the relative and general situation of Europe, and then draw a balance of their respetive force. The imprisonnment of captain d'Au vergne: the insolent declaration of the French, that they would consider the Alien Act as an infraction ef the treaty; the non-fulfilment of the second article,