Imágenes de páginas
PDF
EPUB

A VOICE. That is issued at Indian Wells. That is issued by the trader at Indian Wells.

Senator THOMAS. He is not a licensed trader?

A VOICE. No.

The INTERPRETER. He says that is as much as he will say now. (Witness excused.)

CHA-HE was thereupon called as a witness, and after being first duly sworn, testified through Mr. Gorman (who was sworn as an interpreter), as follows:

Senator FRAZIER. Where do you live?
The INTERPRETER. Right above here.

Senator FRAZIER. Is it the Bird Spring district?

The INTERPRETER. Bird Spring.

Senator FRAZIER. What is he, an Indian policeman?
The INTERPRETER. He does not know what he is.

Senator FRAZIER. What is the badge for?

The INTERPRETER. They told him he was head man; that is the reason why he wears that badge.

Senator FRAZIER. What does he mean by "head man "?

The INTERPRETER. He is head man, or counselor or officer.

Senator FRAZIER. For his chapter?

The INTERPRETER. Yes; for the chapter.

Senator FRAZIER. That is a chapter badge then, is it?

The INTERPRETER. Yes, sir.

Senator FRAZIER. Navajo officer, livestock from Tolchaco, Canyon Diablo chapter, Leupp, and a picture of some livestock and a barn. Who gave you that?

(The witness indicates Superintendent Balmer.)

Senator FRAZIER. The superintendent here?

The INTERPRETER. Yes, sir.

Senator FRAZIER. How about these badges, Mr. Superintendent? Are these badges issued to each chapter member?

Mr. BALMER. So far there is a president and vice president.
Senator FRAZIER. Who furnishes the badges?

Mr. BALMER. The Government.

Senator FRAZIER. Whose idea is that?

Mr. BALMER. Former Superintendent Hunter.

Senator FRAZIER. Have you a statement you want to make to the committee?

The INTERPRETER. Yes, sir.

Senator FRAZIER. All right. Make it brief.

The INTERPRETER. He wants to know the south boundary line of this Leupp jurisdiction?

Senator FRAZIER. He will have to ask the superintendent about that.

Senator WHEELER. You tell him to see the superintendent some other time about that. We have not the time. You see the superintendent and he will explain to you after we are through. Have you any other statement?

The INTERPRETER. He says they are forever talking about this river coming down here and drowning all these children. He says they are always talking about that. We are trying to figure out where would be a safe place for the school to be.

Senator WHEELER. You tell him he does not have to worry about his children being drowned here, and that representatives of the Government are looking around now to find a place, and that his children will be protected and the rest of the Indian children will be protected, so that none of them will be drowned.

The INTERPRETER. He says he appreciates all that the representatives are doing from this school, that all of their children are going to be saved, and he thanks you very much.

Senator FRAZIER. Any other statement?

The INTERPRETER. That is all.

(Witness excused.)

BILA WILLIAMS was thereupon called as a witness and, after being first duly sworn, testified through Marcus Kanuho (who was sworn as an interpreter) as follows:

Senator FRAZIER. Your name is Bila Williams?

The INTERPRETER. Yes, sir.

Senator FRAZIER. Where do you live?

The INTERPRETER. He lives over across the road over there. Senator FRAZIER. Has he a statement he wants to make to the committee?

The INTERPRETER. Yes, sir.

Senator FRAZIER. All right. Tell him to make it brief.

The INTERPRETER. He says you questioned some Indians here concerning improvements in their home and you were questioning them if they wanted houses. He says that is what he has in mind and he wants to put it before you. Last year he wanted to have one of these modern houses built for him across the river where he lives, and he told his superintendent about it.

Senator FRAZIER. What did the superintendent tell him?

The INTERPRETER. He told him to wait and go back and pick out a site where to build this house. So he went back over to his place and picked out a site, and came back to notify the superintendent and the superintendent was not here.

Senator FRAZIER. Then what?

The INTERPRETER. So he waited around here all day and went back home toward dark, and about four days later he came back to see the superintendent about it and the superintendent was here. So he speak to him about it, that he had picked out a site to build a house, but the superintendent, told him to wait again. He always Idid want to have a house since some other officials have been here and talked to them about improving their homes, and he says he had that in mind all the time. For that reason he has been asking the superintendent to help him build a house.

Senator WHEELER. What did the superintendent tell him?

The INTERPRETER. He said he came back and wanted to have this house built. He insisted on having the house built, but the superintendent told him to wait again. He said he don't know whether he had money enough or that appropriation or not. He was going to look through his funds.

Senator FRAZIER. Have you any funds from which you can build houses for these people on the reimbursable plan?

Mr. BALMER. We received $8,000 reimbursable money this year, but the Indians out there at the chapters voted to use that money

mostly for the purchase of wagons, harness, collars, piles, and so forth.

Senator FRAZIER. You say the chapters voted on it?

Mr. BALMER. Yes. Each chapter made up a list of a number of different articles to be purchased for the chapter and to whom it went to. We have used up practically all of that money in that way, and I told him if we had any saving on those purchases I would be glad to help them out with a house. Until we get all the bills paid we can not do anything.

Senator FRAZIER. Does this man belong to a chapter?
The INTERPRETER. He is not the head.

Senator FRAZIER. Is he a member?

The INTERPRETER. He belongs to one; yes, sir.

Senator FRAZIER. Have they not got any funds to help some of these Indians on the reimbursable plan?

Mr. SCATTERGOOD. I think so. He said he had a large indebtedness to work out first. The superintendent just said he thought this man had better work out some indebtedness he already has before he took out something else for a new house.

Senator WHEELER. I did not so understand Mr. Balmer to say that. Did you state that Mr. Balmer?

Senator FRAZIER. Mr. Balmer, did you state this man had some reimbursable now?

Mr. BALMER. No, sir; I could not say that. I said the Indians voted to use this money in purchasing wagons and other things and that most of that money had been used, but if we find out a little later there is a saving in that fund we intend to use it for home building.

Mr. SCATTERGOOD. I as sorry I misunderstood.

Senator WHEELER. He only has $8,000. Altogether that will not go very far. Have you not any funds which you could let the Indians have on a reimbursable plan?

Mr. SCATTERGOOD. We have a fund which is used for that purpose over the country at large. There has been very little demand for such purpose in this place and probably no allotment whatever has been made for them. If in the future such demand arises, he could ask for more money and have some allotted here.

Senator FRAZIER. There seems to be some demand in the last two or three witnesses.

Senator WHEELER. Ask these Indians, Mr. Interpreter, how many of the Indians in his district are that would like to build wooden houses and improve their houses provided they could borrow money from the Government on a reimbursable plan?

Senator FRAZIER. There are about 50.

Senator WHEELER. You tell them Congress or the Government is not going to give it to them. It is going to loan them the money and they must pay it back.

Senator FRAZIER. Any further statement you want to make?

The INTERPRETER. So the last time be came to see him about the house he said he had to wait again; he said, if we have to wait about the house, I let that house go. He says he got another project in mind that was building the reservoir to divert some water to a field where he is planting corn. He said he want a little help there con

cerning feed. He says he has been able to get some feed for horses that they use; so, he says, that is the reason he wants help from the superintendent in getting some hay and oats for his horses.

Senator WHEELER. You tell him they all would like to have the agent give them hay and corn for their horses, but the agent can not do that, but if he wants to build a home or drill a well perhaps the agent could help him do that, loan him some money for that.

The INTERPRETER. Well, he says the reason for that was because he know he was giving other Indians hay and oats and why not him! He says if he was willing to pay back for it on the reimbursable plan he ought to have it.

Senator WHEELER. What Indian did the agent give hay and oats to?

The INTERPRETER. He says all the Indians know it.

Senator WHEELER. Does he know the man?

The INTERPRETER. He says one of the heads of the chapters from Red Lake.

Senator WHEELER. He gave him hay and oats?

The INTERPRETER. Even grub.

Senator WHEELER. What about that? Do you give out oats and hay to some favorites up here and not give it to others?

Mr. BALMER. I would not call them favorites. I gave out some hay and oats and foodstuff to Indians in one case where they were drilling a well and in another case where they were trying to fix up an irrigation project, and we would have given him some oats and hay had we thought the proposition he was wanting to put over could be put over, but, in our opinion, he would throw a lot of work in there that would not be of any benefit to him. We tried that up in that section before and lost our work and we have tried similar work up in Red Lake and lost it up there, and so in order not to waste the small amount of money we did have we keep away from something we are not sure of.

The INTERPRETER. So the only thing he would get out of the superintendent was to have the stockman sent up there to look the project over and he estimated it would cost $1,000 to put that over, so he said he just give it up and went over to the store and got 10 bales of hay and 5 stacks of grain and went back there and put the work over himself.

Senator WHEELER. He did it himself?

The INTERPRETER. He did it himself.

Senator FRAZIER. Did you get any water?

The INTERPRETER. It is a reservoir. So he figured it up. They told him it would cost around $1,000 and he said he put it over for only $30. That is what the hay and grain cost.

Senator FRAZIER. That is, besides his own work?

The INTERPRETER. Yes, sir. So, he says after he got through and finished the work he came over here and notified the superintendent he put the work over himself and that he got the hay and grain from over at the store and the superintendent told him he did not have to pay for the oats and hay over there, that they will pay for that hay and oats he got from the store, and he said he told him, no, he said, that was charged up to him, that he was going to pay for it. Senator WHEELER. Who said he would pay for it? The INTERPRETER. Williams.

Senator WHEELER. Did he say that the superintendent told him he would pay for it?

The INTERPRETER. Yes, sir; after he told the superintendent he put that work over himself by getting some hay and grain from the store and charged it up to himself, then the superintendent told him he was willing to help him by paying that debt he owed for the hay and grain.

Senator WHEELER. He told him he did not want him to pay for it? The INTERPRETER. He was going to pay it himself. That is all I have to say concerning that part of it. He says another thing he wants to say is this: That we Indians like to have our agent be at the agency once in a while when we come here to see him.

Senator WHEELER. That is where he should be once in a while anyway.

The INTERPRETER. Many times I have come here to take up little matters with my superintendent and never found him here.

Senator THOMAS. Ask him if there is not some one at the agency at all times, even when the superintendent is not present, that can take up business matters with him.

The INTERPRETER. He says they do in a lots of cases take up matters with whoever is in charge there, but he says they can not make a decision on various important matter that is brought before him on account of the superintendent is not here. He said he made the statement once that the only time he will be here, that the Indians may see him concerning some business, was on Mondays. He says to them it seems queer that the agent that is here for the benefit of the Indians is away all the time.

Senator WHEELER. Where does he spend his time? Where does the agent spend his time, does he know?

The INTERPRETER. He says I do not know where he goes. He says all the Indians are talking about it. He said our agent is not here. Senator WHEELER. What about that Mr. Superintendent? Do you have more than one day that you see these Indians?

Mr. BALMER. I mentioned to them that if this outside work continued we will probably have to keep to that one day. We have not done it. I told them if the outside work increases we would have to name one day in the week to be in the office, so that when they did come there I would be there.

Senator WHEELER. You ought to have some time fixed and they ought to know

Mr. BALMER. The chief clerk is always in, charged with authority to act on those things.

Senator FRAZIER. He said that the chief clerk always passes the buck.

Mr. BALMER. I would like to have Williams tell what cases he has reference to. What cases were they that the buck was passed? The INTERPRETER. He says I have one reference to make. During the time I was coming over here to see him about putting in this reservoir I saw the chief clerk and he said he could not say anything on it until the superintendent came back.

Mr. BALMER. We took the case up he mentioned. I took it up. The INTERPRETER. One thing further I want to ask my superintendent. He says when we come to see him or when I come to see him about certain things like concerning this reservoir and houses

« AnteriorContinuar »