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they have within their power the enforcement of state laws, does not appeal to me. It is in violation of the cardinal principle, it seems to me, for which this organization contends, namely, home rule.

This question of police regulation and organization I believe is the most important one we have to deal with in our municipalities; and the proper and effective regulation of it is an absolute impossibility, in my judgment, because of the conditions that exist, and which cannot be removed at present. I am aware that this is not a very hopeful view; but

so long as you have upon your statute books laws, Unenforced which the community by its public sentiment generLaws

ally understands are not to be enforced, laws against

the social evil, for example, on an understanding implied by the public sentiment of the community and not only by the orders from the authorities, you have inherent in the whole situation the very virus that must poison the entire system. There is no subject so fruitful of corruption, of bribery, of graft, of everything that militates against an efficient police force. You have an element, and a large element, which exists on violation of law, known to be there, their presence absolutely disclosed, and usually listed in the offices of the police, and every member known to them; and yet they are there allowed to remain, and must remain with the present temper of the public morality of our respective communities, and the sentiment of the public upon the subject. Every policeman, therefore, every man upon the beat, every captain, and the men higher up, going from the top clear down to the bottom, have here an element upon which they can levy tribute, an element from which they will levy tribute, and an element upon which they have levied tribute in every city in the world, to-day and in the past. Now how are you going to have an honest and efficient police force, when you tolerate, when you permit to continue that condition of affairs? You say to your policemen, “ You must be honest "; you tell that to those who are upon the beat, and to their superiors; and yet at the same time you put there before the policeman that which makes it absolutely impossible for him to be honest, and which compels a violation of his oath of office from the moment he takes the oath until he resigns from the force.

This is true not only with reference to that subject, but with reference to many minor laws that are passed in our respective communities, notably for example speed laws with reference to automobiles. One-half, you might say almost all the ordinances and laws of this character that are passed in our respective cities for the regulation of traffic and general conditions, it is understood are not to be strictly and absolutely enforced. Thereby you create in the minds of the police, you create in the minds of the community, which is a matter far more serious than the injury to the force itself, a disrespect for law; and after all the sole line of demarcation between civilization and barbarism is respect for the law, and as that respect for law decreases you approach closer and closer to barbarism.

And in line with the paper by Miss Abbott and the discussion following, when you place before the immigrant who comes into the country this object lesson in disrespect for the law which comes to them immediately upon their settlement here, what can you expect from their children in the way of good citizenship when you have given them this object lesson of disrespect for our laws and institutions ?

I have taken up more time than I intended. I have called attention to the special feature of the social evil. I want to make a suggestion as

to what in my humble opinion is a remedy. And in The Social Evil making this statement I know that I am taking some

what advanced ground and will possibly call down upon my head the opprobrium of many if not all; when I say that I am in favor of repealing on the statute books those laws existing at the present time on the subject of the social evil. I would take them offwhatever may be my individual opinion and judgment upon the subject of the evil, which is not involved in that suggestion.

I would take off from the statute books every other law which the public sentiment of the community does not demand the enforcement of; and then I would enforce every remaining law, and enforce it rigorously; and if it was a bad law or one that was contrary to the sentiment of the community, I would enforce it still more strongly if possible until the law was repealed. And I would insist, and the community should insist, and those who have the enforcement of the law should insist, that the man who takes an oath of office and swears that he will enforce the law, shall either enforce the law or be prosecuted for failure so to do, I care not what that law may be. In that way, and in that way only, you will encourage respect for the law. [Applause.)

Hon. WILLIAM DUDLEY FOULKE, Richmond, Ind.: Notwithstanding the divergent views of the gentlemen who have expressed themselves, notwithstanding that they differ so widely with each other, I find myself in complete agreement with them all. You will remember some years ago there was a banquet of the National Civil Service Reform League in New York, at which Theodore Roosevelt, who was then Governor of the State of New York, made a little speech, and I think I had the honor of sitting by yourself, Mr. President. Mr. Roosevelt spoke there, and spoke very well indeed, in regard to the difference between the civil service rules which would properly apply to admission to the service and those which would be applicable to promotion in the service; that whereas every man recognized that the scholastic qualifications, that is those that were possible, were admirable for admission, that they were not always equally good for promotion; that promotion has to depend upon the circumstances of the particular service or particular environment. And then he gave an illustration of the men who were employed on the borders of the Rio Grande for the purpose of preventing smuggling, and he said it was not so necessary that a man should have some scholastic qualifications as that he should be able to shoot straight, in case it should be necessary and he got into trouble. And I think it was yourself who proposed that in regard to such competition as that if they fell short of other material they might shoot at each other, in which events the necessity of passing upon their papers would be entirely eliminated and the civil service commissioner would find no difficulty in disposing of the matter of promotion. But there are some places where promotions are of necessity based upon competitive written examinations; for instance, for appointments under the Commissioner of Patents. There of course knowledge of mechanics is demanded and technical qualifications of the very highest importance. In such a case a written examination will show which man is the best.

But with reference to promotions on the police Promotions force we cannot entirely rely on any such method of

written examination. You must consider that the primary object of civil service reform was to secure the best appointees, and no one claims that appointees under the civil service always make the best servants. The only thing that is certain is that it is a better system than any other that we know anything about. The main purpose was to keep out political influence.

Now then if political influence can be entirely kept out of the police force, and kept out of the top as well as the bottom, not merely the general force of the policemen but the commissioner himself, if we can prevent men being appointed to such places on account of any political qualifications that they have, I think we might almost say that we could leave promotion to the discretion of the commissioner afterwards. I would almost go so far as that.

I must say that I am not disposed to agree without further thinking about it with the suggestion that members of the police force should select their own captains and their own officers; but in the lower grades of the service I would like to see that tried and see how it would work out. It sometimes worked pretty well in the earlier days of the Civil War when the recruited men did choose their own captains.

With regard to a modification of the present regulations we should first be sure that we are going to get something better than we have. We will never get an ideal system of promotion. The thing to be considered in regard to changing any system is, what is the alternative? As much as I like the paper and agree with nearly everything in it, I was very sorry that there was no final conclusion. Everything that was proposed seemed impossible. So as Dooley says, “ There you are!"

I think it would be extremely wise for the Governor to have a sort of veto power, and after charges preferred and after trial to commission, and to remove the mayor too, if necessary. I think that suggestion is extremely valuable, and I hope it will be further considered. In regard to this question of the social evil, and also the question of the enforcement of excise laws, I am not sure but what even Mr. Weil's suggestion would be better than the present system; but there is this to be considered about that, local self-government will do a great

ve the

deal in the smaller cities of this country. The presThe Social Evil ent laws against the social evil can be enforced, and

where they can be enforced they ought to be enforced. It would be therefore far better to have these laws themselves depend upon the will of a particular local community than to have them depend upon the will of the state legislature and made applicable to many cities, in some of which they are enforceable and ought to be enforced, and in some other cities cannot be enforced at all. I suppose it would be very difficult to enforce a law of that kind in such a city as New York.

Mr. Veiller, formerly of the tenement house commission, has perhaps a wider knowledge than any other man of tenement house conditions and of the general moral conditions of the city of New York in that respect. He made a suggestion to me that I consider very valuable. He said that above all things the law should be drastic, and the penalty should be very severe, in excluding that evil from the tenement house district of the city, but he said, “After you have once done that is it not better, in order to avoid temptation to the police force to use that for the purpose of graft and blackmail, would it not be far better to make that depend upon private law, which allows a nuisance to be abated at the suggestion of any of the neighbors around, that suffer from the nuisance? In that case a good policeman could utilize the law for the purpose of filing his own complaints, and there would always be a remedy against the nuisance and a sufficient punishment.” It struck me that that was an extremely wise suggestion. It came from a man of very large experience. So I say that in spite of the widely divergent views of all these gentlemen, I am inclined to agree with them all. (Applause.)

MR. FRANK N. HARTWELL, Louisville, Ky.: I think we have demonstrated in Louisville that we can take a police force which was entirely unsatisfactory, apparently corrupt, apparently co-operating with the worst element, and by putting into power those who desire different conditions, revolutionize it completely. I think we will be obliged to admit that the character and the conduct of the police department in every city is determined by the higher powers. You get from the servants of the people in subordinate positions just such character of service as those above them instruct them that they must mete out to the public.

In 1905, we had one of the most corrupt elections, of which it is possible to conceive. The police force assisted the thugs and the repeaters to browbeat and to assault the reputable citizens who were serving in the capacity of election officers and challengers, frightening men away from the polls, and in one ward taking away bodily from as many as ten precincts all of the election paraphernalia, and making precincts of their own; taking the registration books and entering names alphabetically. In other precincts where it was necessary to carry their purpose armed men invaded the voting places and knocked over or shot at, or confused to the extent of making them seek places of safety the election officers of the precinct, and in all such ways carried the day. No man felt safe to go and cast his ballot under such conditions. That was in 1905. We con

tested that election in 1906 and some fourteen thousLouisville and pages of depositions were carried up to the Court Conditions of Appeals, having been turned down by our chan

cellors, and the Court of Appeals reversed the decision in the lower court, and threw out the election. In 1907 the people put into power the Republicans, with Mr. Grinstead as Mayor. He placed in power J. H. Hager as Chief of Police. Our mayor, the chief of police, and the police department and the fire department are under the control of what we call a board of safety, composed of three members appointed by the Mayor. These men were of the highest character of citizenship, men of ability; and from the very day that Hager was put into power he commenced reorganizing the force. That man took practically the same men that in 1905 had helped terrorize the town, and when he left, when we were turned down at this last election in November unfortunately, during those two years we had one of the best fire and police departments in the State. The policemen had been as nearly as possible removed from political domination, and all political assessments withdrawn. They were a self-respecting and law-abiding body of men in the community, and when they had occasion to parade the streets they made just as creditable a showing as any body of militia could have done.

I simply said this so as to simplify things. It seems to me that it is simply a matter of having the right man in authority over your police. Have an efficient chief of police, and the character of the police department will take care of itself.

PROF. JOHN A. FAIRLIE, University of Illinois: I wish to say just a word in support of one feature of Prof. Hatton's paper. I believe that a system of state inspection of local police is one of the most im

portant of the proposed reforms that could be made State Inspection in this country. I do not believe that that interferes of Police

in the slightest with any reasonable demands for local

or municipal control. We have such a system of state supervision over very many other branches of local administration that has come to be accepted without any question whatever. We believe in a system of local school administration, and we have our local school boards, but we also have our state superintendent of public instruction.

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